April 02, 2003
Greeks Praise "Black Spark, White Fire"?
Mr. Poe writes that:
Previously, Black Spark had aroused nothing but praise from Greeks -- specialists and non-specialists alike. Archaeologist Theodore Spyropoulos -- who has done 30 years of field work directly related to the prehistoric Greek cultures discussed in Black Spark, White Fire -- strongly endorses the book and believes it glorifies Greece rather than defaming it.
It is entirely possible that Greeks, specialists and non-specialists alike might praise "Black Spark, White Fire". Since it is a book about Greece, at least as much as it is about Egypt, it would be a good move to have it translated into Greek, so that we may obtain a more objective picture of how Greeks feel about such a book.
The works of Martin Bernal, on which Black Spark, White Fire is largely based, have not been met with praise in Greece. Indeed, as I have hinted before, they, as well as Afrocentrism in general, are dismissed as being part of US racial politics, rather than objective investigations into Eastern Mediterranean history.
Incidentally, Theodore Spyropoulos, the only Greek whom Mr. Poe submits as a supporter of his book, has not made (to my knowledge) any direct judgement or review of the book. Black Spark, White Fire involves much more than the question of whether the hill of Amphion is a pyramid or not, and whether it was built by Egyptians, or not.
Perhaps Greeks will one day come out with praise for Black Spark, White Fire. A Greek's praise would certainly look great in the back cover of the book, which contains at present the praise of: Molefi Kete Asante, author of Afrocentricity: The theory of Social Change, Martin bernal, author of Black Athena: The Afroasiatic Roots of Classical Civilization (The Fabrication of Ancient Greece 1785-1985) , and Armstrong Williams.
Posted by Dienekes at April 2, 2003 05:24 PM | PermaLink
HEY POE ,
I KNOW YOU READ THIS BLOG MALAKESMENOU GYFTOS SO HERE ARE A FEW THOUGHTS .
YOU ARE A DISPICABLE ENEMY OF GREEK PEOPLE .
YOU ARE ANTI WHITE
YOUR A PHONY CONSERVITIVE ( IN REALITY YOUR A MARXIST LIKE YOUR BUDDY BERNAL THAT HIDES UNDER A CONSERVATIVE AGENDA-(BTW I AM GREEK AMERICAN (100% GREEK BY BLOOD MANIATI/ MACEDONIAN. UNLIKE YOU I DO NOT HAVE MIXED ANCESTRY TO FEEL INSECURE ABOUT -AS YOU STATE IN YOUR BLOG )AS I REAPEATED BEFORE I NOT A GREEK NATIONAL .
I SEE THAT YOU ALSO MISREPRESENT THE HISTORY OF LEBONESE PEOPLE (PHONICEANS).YOU ALSO HAVE A PROBLEM WITH EGYPTIANS THAT DISAGEE WITH THE WAY YOU REPRESENTED THEIR HISTORY AND WHITE MEXICANS WHO ARE PROUD OF THEIR EUROPEAN SPANISH HERITAGE.
YOU ALSO BELEIVE YOUR A PROPHET SINCE YOU PREACH THE GOSPEL TO DIENEKES .
NO DIENEKES IS NOT LEADING ANY GREEK CRUSADE NOR DOES DIENEKES CLAIM TO BE A LEADER.I DISAGREE WITH DIENEKES ON CERTAIN POINTS .HOWEVER, WE SHARE A COMMON INTREST IN DEFENDING OUR HELLENIC ANCESTRY FROM PARASITES LIKE YOU WHO WISH TO REWRITE OUR HISTORY FOR YOUR TWISTED AGENDA.AS FOR GREEK NATIONALIST TYPES http://www.metopo.gr/start_en.htm , YOU SHOULD LOOK THEM UP NEXT TIME YOUR IN GREECE AND ASK THEM WHAT THEY THINK OF YOUR IDEAS- PSEFTIES
I DOUBT THEY WOULD CONSIDER YOUR BOOK THE WORK OF A PHIL HELLENE
ANYHOW POE ONCE AGAIN
: EXPOSING RICHARD POE
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
DORIC GREEK ... 2003-03-31
Richard Poe the Author of a Black Fire White Spark has proven by his recent actions that he is unable to defend and unwilling to defend the premise on which he basis his book. The general theme of Poe's book is that so called black Egyptians colonized and civilized Europe via ancient Hellas. A recent example of is Poe's response to Dienekes Pontikos.Dienekes points out some serious flaws regarding Poe's interpitation of Greek history. Poe rather then defending his position in his book tries to change the topic to how Dienekes defines whiteness or caucasian.
Of course this is typical of Poe when he is confronted. I presented Poe with all factual information regarding the physical anthrometric data of the Greeks since antiquity. It is proven and documented that Greeks since antiquity are composed of various WHITE RACIAL TYPES native to Europe. The leading Physical Anthropologist who have studied the morphology of Greek remains include Carleton Coon ,GL Angel,Aris Poulianos,Baker,Roland Dixon , F. G. Debetz .All are in general agreement general that Greeks since early antiquity have been composed of an Alpine/Dinarid (robust stocky central -southeastern european balkan type ) with strong mediteranean (gracile slim brunette southern european type of the mediteranean coastal areas ) and weak nordic links. ( tall slim Scandinavian or northern european type).When confronted by with the facts I presented him , Poe responded by claiming I was ruthlessly attacking him or that I was rude ect. Poe kept on asking me what the following conclusions from the leading anthropological experts have to do with his book that states afrosemetic roots for Greece. It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out that if afrosemetic negroid types had a major role in ancient Greece that there would be plenty of skeletal remains uncovered to confirm their presence.Poe does mention GL Angel in his book but he avoids Angel's basic conclusions. Poe states in his historical fiction book that black Egyptians played a significant role in Mycenaean Greece. However, GL Angel concludes that the central trend of the warrior Aristocracy of Mycenae was a robust Alpine/Dinarid type which Poulianos refers to as an Epiroti type native to northern Greece from the area around Mt Olympus ..http://www.aee.gr/english/4greeks_origin/greeks_origin.html Poe obviously is not mentally capable of comprehending the works of GL Angel .Angel referred to other skeletal types associated with ancient Greece as Iranian Nordic classic Mediterranean ect.Of course Poe avoids discussing such realities because he has very limited knowledge of Greek history .His main source is a propaganda piece written by his idol the MARXIST MARTIN BERNAL called Black Athena.
Martin Bernal an a ASIAN STUDIES instructor who over night became a Classical Greek scholar while he was getting in touch with his called so Semitic CANANITE roots (as Bernal himself states) is Poe's idea of what a ancient Greek historian is all about.Also Poe's degree in creative writing (a good degree for writing fiction novels) is his main educational credential for his so called Ancient Greek expertise.So we have an Asian Studies instructor and Journalist trained as a creative writer who claim to have made new discoveries into Greek origins while real classical like Dr Nicholas Hammond
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Archive/Article/0%2C4273%2C4165439%2C00.html who have dedicated their life to Classical Greek history have a totally different version.
Now what is the motive of Bernal a Marxist and Poe (A Marxist hiding under a conservative agenda)
Bernal states he does not like the ARYAN theory of German historians. Poe states Neo Nazis are his enemies .Of course we do know that the Nazis did try to link themselves as to ancient Hellas via the Aryan race .Poe and Bernal via their ethnic back round have a valid reason for wanting to fight against NAZI ideology, however, that does not give them the right to rewrite the history of Greek people in order to pursue their crusade. Poe mentions in one of his blogs the following - While I cannot claim to be entirely free of hang-ups, insecurities and unexamined emotions regarding my own somewhat mixed ancestry-http://www.richardpoe.com/blog.php-So Poe has a problem with his somewhat mixed ancestry so he wishes other people to be mongrelized so that he can feel better about his own insecurity from his somewhat mixed ancestry. That explains why Poe got bent out of shape when he was presented with the fact that Greeks have strong genetic continuity with their ancient ancestors.
The following conclusion can be made about Richard Poe –
1. He is an enemy of Greek people since he wishes to distort their history.
2 Poe is a anti white –This is evident since he goes out of his way to disassociate Greek history and
Greek people from the white race despite the evidence that Greeks since recorded history are composed of various white racial types native to the Balkans.
2. Poe has a problem with white pride types so he wishes to purposely and maliciously falsify the
history of Greek people as a means of dealing with his so called enemies.
3 Poe has a problem with his own mixed ancestry as he states himself and he wishes to label people who are not racial mixed as mixed as means of deal with his insecurities.
4 Poe runs away from defending his position when challenged by making accusations that he is being abused or completely changing the topic.
5. Finally the theories mentioned in Poe’s book Black Fire white Spark should be given the same
amount of respect as the Space Alien theories
Posted by Doric Greek at April 2, 2003 11:37 AM
Poe once you prove to be nothing more then a personal propagandist that twists facts and avoids the topics.Pontikos is not my inspirational guru .Rather then responding to my posts you direct your comments to Dienekes.As for sources are I use GL Angel,Coon,Hammond ,Baker,Poulianos,Roland Dixon ect not Pontikos.All of these sources have far superior credentials to you and your MARXIST mentor Bernal.Dienekes to his credit created a site that provides the facts associated with the racial identity of Greek people since pre history.Nicholas Hammond, a historian is a source that Dienekes does not mention on his site.
Hey Poe rather than cutting out a portion of my message why not post the entire article titled EXPOSING RICHARD POE ONCE AGAIN -I guess you do not want your readers to see it
EXPOSING RICHARD POE
DORIC GREEK ... 2003-03-31
Richard Poe the Author of a Black Fire White Spark has proven by his recent actions that he is unable to defend and unwilling to defend the premise on which he basis his book. The general theme of Poe's book is that so called black Egyptians colonized and civilized Europe via ancient Hellas. A recent example of is Poe's response to Dienekes Pontikos.Dienekes points out some serious flaws regarding Poe's interpitation of Greek history. Poe rather then defending his position in his book tries to change the topic to how Dienekes defines whiteness or caucasian. http://dienekes.com/blog/
Of course this is typical of Poe when he is confronted. I presented Poe with all factual information regarding the physical anthrometric data of the Greeks since antiquity. It is proven and documented that Greeks since antiquity are composed of various WHITE RACIAL TYPES native to Europe. The leading Physical Anthropologist who have studied the morphology of Greek remains include Carleton Coon ,GL Angel,Aris Poulianos,Baker,Roland Dixon , F. G. Debetz .All are in general agreement general that Greeks since early antiquity have been composed of an Alpine/Dinarid (robust stocky central -southeastern european balkan type ) with strong mediteranean (gracile slim brunette southern european type of the mediteranean coastal areas ) and weak nordic links. ( tall slim Scandinavian or northern european type).When confronted by with the facts I presented him , Poe responded by claiming I was ruthlessly attacking him or that I was rude ect. Poe kept on asking me what the following conclusions from the leading anthropological experts have to do with his book that states afrosemetic roots for Greece. It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out that if afrosemetic negroid types had a major role in ancient Greece that there would be plenty of skeletal remains uncovered to confirm their presence.Poe does mention GL Angel in his book but he avoids Angel's basic conclusions. Poe states in his historical fiction book that black Egyptians played a significant role in Mycenaean Greece. However, GL Angel concludes that the central trend of the warrior Aristocracy of Mycenae was a robust Alpine/Dinarid type which Poulianos refers to as an Epiroti type native to northern Greece from the area around Mt Olympus ..http://www.aee.gr/english/4greeks_origin/greeks_origin.html Poe obviously is not mentally capable of comprehending the works of GL Angel .Angel referred to other skeletal types associated with ancient Greece as Iranian Nordic classic Mediterranean ect.Of course Poe avoids discussing such realities because he has very limited knowledge of Greek history .His main source is a propaganda piece written by his idol the MARXIST MARTIN BERNAL called Black Athena.
Martin Bernal an a ASIAN STUDIES instructor who over night became a Classical Greek scholar while he was getting in touch with his called so Semitic CANANITE roots (as Bernal himself states) is Poe's idea of what a ancient Greek historian is all about.Also Poe's degree in creative writing (a good degree for writing fiction novels) is his main educational credential for his so called Ancient Greek expertise.So we have an Asian Studies instructor and Journalist trained as a creative writer who claim to have made new discoveries into Greek origins while real classical like Dr Nicholas Hammond
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Archive/Article/0%2C4273%2C4165439%2C00.html who have dedicated their life to Classical Greek history have a totally different version.
Now what is the motive of Bernal a Marxist and Poe (A Marxist hiding under a conservative agenda)
Bernal states he does not like the ARYAN theory of German historians. Poe states Neo Nazis are his enemies .Of course we do know that the Nazis did try to link themselves as to ancient Hellas via the Aryan race .Poe and Bernal via their ethnic back round have a valid reason for wanting to fight against NAZI ideology, however, that does not give them the right to rewrite the history of Greek people in order to pursue their crusade. Poe mentions in one of his blogs the following - While I cannot claim to be entirely free of hang-ups, insecurities and unexamined emotions regarding my own somewhat mixed ancestry-http://www.richardpoe.com/blog.php-So Poe has a problem with his somewhat mixed ancestry so he wishes other people to be mongrelized so that he can feel better about his own insecurity from his somewhat mixed ancestry. That explains why Poe got bent out of shape when he was presented with the fact that Greeks have strong genetic continuity with their ancient ancestors.
The following conclusion can be made about Richard Poe –
1. He is an enemy of Greek people since he wishes to distort their history.
2 Poe is a anti white –This is evident since he goes out of his way to disassociate Greek history and
Greek people from the white race despite the evidence that Greeks since recorded history are composed of various white racial types native to the Balkans.
2. Poe has a problem with white pride types so he wishes to purposely and maliciously falsify the
history of Greek people as a means of dealing with his so called enemies.
3 Poe has a problem with his own mixed ancestry as he states himself and he wishes to label people who are not racial mixed as mixed as means of deal with his insecurities.
4 Poe runs away from defending his position when challenged by making accusations that he is being abused or completely changing the topic.
5. Finally the theories mentioned in Poe’s book Black Fire white Spark should be given the same
amount of respect as the Space Alien theories
http://www.richardpoe.com/
Posted by: Doric Greek at April 3, 2003 08:35 AM
Poe once you prove to be nothing more then a personal propagandist that twists facts and avoids the topics.Pontikos is not my inspirational guru .Rather then responding to my posts you direct your comments to Dienekes.As for sources are I use GL Angel,Coon,Hammond ,Baker,Poulianos,Roland Dixon ect not Pontikos.All of these sources have far superior credentials to you and your MARXIST mentor Bernal.Dienekes to his credit created a site that provides the facts associated with the racial identity of Greek people since pre history.Nicholas Hammond, a historian is a source that Dienekes does not mention on his site.
Hey Poe rather than cutting out a portion of my message why not post the entire article titled EXPOSING RICHARD POE ONCE AGAIN -I guess you do not want your readers to see it
EXPOSING RICHARD POE
DORIC GREEK ... 2003-03-31
Richard Poe the Author of a Black Fire White Spark has proven by his recent actions that he is unable to defend and unwilling to defend the premise on which he basis his book. The general theme of Poe's book is that so called black Egyptians colonized and civilized Europe via ancient Hellas. A recent example of is Poe's response to Dienekes Pontikos.Dienekes points out some serious flaws regarding Poe's interpitation of Greek history. Poe rather then defending his position in his book tries to change the topic to how Dienekes defines whiteness or caucasian. http://dienekes.com/blog/
Of course this is typical of Poe when he is confronted. I presented Poe with all factual information regarding the physical anthrometric data of the Greeks since antiquity. It is proven and documented that Greeks since antiquity are composed of various WHITE RACIAL TYPES native to Europe. The leading Physical Anthropologist who have studied the morphology of Greek remains include Carleton Coon ,GL Angel,Aris Poulianos,Baker,Roland Dixon , F. G. Debetz .All are in general agreement general that Greeks since early antiquity have been composed of an Alpine/Dinarid (robust stocky central -southeastern european balkan type ) with strong mediteranean (gracile slim brunette southern european type of the mediteranean coastal areas ) and weak nordic links. ( tall slim Scandinavian or northern european type).When confronted by with the facts I presented him , Poe responded by claiming I was ruthlessly attacking him or that I was rude ect. Poe kept on asking me what the following conclusions from the leading anthropological experts have to do with his book that states afrosemetic roots for Greece. It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out that if afrosemetic negroid types had a major role in ancient Greece that there would be plenty of skeletal remains uncovered to confirm their presence.Poe does mention GL Angel in his book but he avoids Angel's basic conclusions. Poe states in his historical fiction book that black Egyptians played a significant role in Mycenaean Greece. However, GL Angel concludes that the central trend of the warrior Aristocracy of Mycenae was a robust Alpine/Dinarid type which Poulianos refers to as an Epiroti type native to northern Greece from the area around Mt Olympus ..http://www.aee.gr/english/4greeks_origin/greeks_origin.html Poe obviously is not mentally capable of comprehending the works of GL Angel .Angel referred to other skeletal types associated with ancient Greece as Iranian Nordic classic Mediterranean ect.Of course Poe avoids discussing such realities because he has very limited knowledge of Greek history .His main source is a propaganda piece written by his idol the MARXIST MARTIN BERNAL called Black Athena.
Martin Bernal an a ASIAN STUDIES instructor who over night became a Classical Greek scholar while he was getting in touch with his called so Semitic CANANITE roots (as Bernal himself states) is Poe's idea of what a ancient Greek historian is all about.Also Poe's degree in creative writing (a good degree for writing fiction novels) is his main educational credential for his so called Ancient Greek expertise.So we have an Asian Studies instructor and Journalist trained as a creative writer who claim to have made new discoveries into Greek origins while real classical like Dr Nicholas Hammond
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Archive/Article/0%2C4273%2C4165439%2C00.html who have dedicated their life to Classical Greek history have a totally different version.
Now what is the motive of Bernal a Marxist and Poe (A Marxist hiding under a conservative agenda)
Bernal states he does not like the ARYAN theory of German historians. Poe states Neo Nazis are his enemies .Of course we do know that the Nazis did try to link themselves as to ancient Hellas via the Aryan race .Poe and Bernal via their ethnic back round have a valid reason for wanting to fight against NAZI ideology, however, that does not give them the right to rewrite the history of Greek people in order to pursue their crusade. Poe mentions in one of his blogs the following - While I cannot claim to be entirely free of hang-ups, insecurities and unexamined emotions regarding my own somewhat mixed ancestry-http://www.richardpoe.com/blog.php-So Poe has a problem with his somewhat mixed ancestry so he wishes other people to be mongrelized so that he can feel better about his own insecurity from his somewhat mixed ancestry. That explains why Poe got bent out of shape when he was presented with the fact that Greeks have strong genetic continuity with their ancient ancestors.
The following conclusion can be made about Richard Poe –
1. He is an enemy of Greek people since he wishes to distort their history.
2 Poe is a anti white –This is evident since he goes out of his way to disassociate Greek history and
Greek people from the white race despite the evidence that Greeks since recorded history are composed of various white racial types native to the Balkans.
2. Poe has a problem with white pride types so he wishes to purposely and maliciously falsify the
history of Greek people as a means of dealing with his so called enemies.
3 Poe has a problem with his own mixed ancestry as he states himself and he wishes to label people who are not racial mixed as mixed as means of deal with his insecurities.
4 Poe runs away from defending his position when challenged by making accusations that he is being abused or completely changing the topic.
5. Finally the theories mentioned in Poe’s book Black Fire white Spark should be given the same
amount of respect as the Space Alien theories
http://www.richardpoe.com/
Posted by: Doric Greek at April 3, 2003 08:35 AMFlooding the comment boxes of every entry with this essay is not very polite to Dienekes, Doric Greek. Please show some decorum.
Posted by: Jason Malloy at April 3, 2003 10:51 AM
Jason,
Unfortunately the only way to get my message to Poe is write on this blog since he reads it.Poe did link his blog to this thread.I am not concerned with showing politeness to Mr Poe an anti White anti Greek racist.If Dienekes finds my posting of this essay on a frequent basis offensive he certainly can e mail me and let me know.The reason why I continually post this essay under every entry is that Poes comments attitude and behavior prove my essay is 100% correct and applies to virtially every entry Poe states on his board. Poe is paranoid that Greeks are pointing out the fact that his book is nothing a then a work of fictional wishful thinking. Any how I think that it is quite humorous Poe tries to link me to Dienekes since I do not know Dienekes nor I ever quoted him as an authority.This is another avoidence technique used by Poe since he is more obsessed with Dienekes then he is defending the theme of his book.That should be obvious to any logical reader.
Posted by: Doric Greek at April 3, 2003 11:29 AMthe neogreeks are mixed people after 1912 wars. before was of hellenic race. Now they are multyracial as thye magiority of european cauntries. For example germany have 1,5 germans of asiatic race,sweden the same ecc. Americans they dont know what they are. The word "white" dont mean nothing. Slavic with saxonic blod? German with finish blod? Scandinavian with slavic blod? "whites" of semitic heritage and blond hair? S.europeans with "nordic" faces? This mean "white"? NO,this mean myltiracial people.
Posted by: demetrius at January 12, 2004 05:29 PMFirst of all homeboiz Greeks are not white or not black we got are on culture so i dont no wat the fuck both of u guyz are talkin about parden my language but hey macedonian relax my friend ur american Greek so stop flexin and u poe relax my friend dont be beefin with a non real greek if u want talk to me.
Posted by: Kosta at February 17, 2004 01:34 PM